fantasy. it is real. and will bring the economy to its knees at last temporarily if they don't fix that. you talk to economists on the left, on the right, they would really have agreement. you don't think it is serious? >> cbo said if we go over the fiscal cliff unemployment would be over 9%. if we go over it, it is still going to be over 9%. if we stop, it will be close to 9% only half a point difference which is a lot, i'm not minimizing it. >> it has to do with what the trajectory of growth is in the economy which is critical. the other element here, you're talking about what the republicans should do, gingrich is talking about what the republicans should do. i think they need to come forward with a reasonable proposal, and say look this is what we want. paul ryan who said, the real problem in all of this, yeah taxes, they are going to be disputes about how you get revenue. the real problem is runaway entitlement spending. >> sean: absolutely. >> it is the big elephant in every room. and the republicans say let's do something about it when i talked to obama in july he said, "it is an